So, thanks to 'fans' of Elodie Frégé, the French Anti-Piracy Bureau is knocking on my door. Their demands (in short): close down the site, or we will throw you in jail for three years. Now, I'm not easily impressed, but I do admit a tiny sweatdrop is starting to form just above my right eye. Should I tell 'm to go f*ck themselves (in a nice way), or should I continue without posting mp3's? Anyone had any experience with this, and hence any advice?
btw; the Belgian counterpart of the SCPP are also on the warpath against this blog. Nice.
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I'm sure the nice people at stereogum can give you some advice...
BeantwoordenVerwijderenThis is a shame - you're actually doing a lot to introduce people around the world to music they wouldn't otherwise have access to. I've got Jane Birkin and France Gall CDs in my Amazon wishlist (okay, so I haven't bought them yet) because of my exposure to them here.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenactually, you're doing promo for free (especially in case of Elodie), but they won't discuss that with you. on the other hand: what are they going to do? come to your house and handcuff you? take Elodie off the web and keep on, good luck, XXX
BeantwoordenVerwijderenThey want me to take down almost every mp3 on my blog, actually.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenBummer and a bloody shame it is! If they only knew how much CD's I bought after listening to files found here or else on the internet. To me it's pure promotional, I allready even ordered that Elodie CD at my recordstore!
BeantwoordenVerwijderenBut well, they might be able to stop FS at THIS location, but they also know that it's no use hunting after relatively small sites as yours. They will appear somewhere else on the net. Threatening with three years jail is pathetic and not to be judged by a French organization, so I think that ain't no serious threat.
And besides that, Elodie files are so easily to be found on the internet that it's no use chasing all those sites and they know it. Nevertheless I'm afraid you're just a victim of their assertiveness and blind ambition to shut down a site every once in a while, simply because they have to and to keep their subsidy. Bastards.
Here's what I emailed to Stephane.Luino@scpp.fr:
BeantwoordenVerwijderenCher Stéphane,
Excuse me for replying in English - although I love France, the French language and les Français, my knowledge of the language falls short when it comes to writing emails or letters. But I'm sure you, or a collegue from SCPP-headquarters, can translate.
As you probably noticed, I took down the Elodie Frégé-mp3's, I can see your point when it comes to music that's not officially released. Still, I think I'm doing the artist a huge favour in making her music more known around the world. Sure, she didn't specifically ask me to do so, but then again, if you're a singer, I assume you want as much people as possible to enjoy your music.
That's what my weblog in essence is about: to introduce and discuss wonderful French music. I don't get paid to do so, in fact, it's costing me money. Yes, all music posted on my blog is paid for. By me. For real. And I encourage visitors to go out and buy the albums from the artists I praise - I know for a fact that lots of visitors actually did so. Most of the time from countries where the albums by, say, Elodie, Axelle, Lio or Romane weren't even released. I'm not stealing from the artist, I'm making them money.
By way of my blog, I'm expanding the fanbase of said artists (in fact all artists on my blog) in the world, just like millions of fellow bloggers who are so in love with music, they just can't stop talking and writing about it - in between listening and enjoying.
So instead of threatening me with jailtime, I honestly think you should be applauding me for spreading my enthusiasm.
No, I won't take down the mp3's by Lio, Romane, Axelle or the others. Go prosecute some real criminals.
ok thats just stupid. most of the mp3s are only here temporarily, and just for promotional purposes, and to share new songs or old favourites.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenand i didnt even know any french word or bothered with it until i stumbled upon this place, now im beatboxing to camille's le fil album everyday.
see? ur promoting french music. somebody (me) bought an album. and probably looking to get some others.
shutting this place down will be a disservice to them
Look, this post won't help you in any way. But I'm from Brazil and visit your blog every day. Without your blog I wouldn't have known any artists you present everyday. So, hang in there. Perhaps, you can use this as an argument. You can say that people in Brazil are buying Elodie CDs because of you.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenBest regards
it's such a shame, I'm really not buying the whole theory of mp3 online impeding artists to sell copies of their cds...it's a great way of communicating and promoting albums and artists... I'm really sorry for you, your blog is amazing. I hope everything will be alrigh for you... good luck!
BeantwoordenVerwijderenIf it were not for your wonderful blog, I would not have bought 2 cds of the artist Camille.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenAnd there are dozens of French speaking artists I never would have heard, were it not for you.
Thank you, and Good luck!
the anti-piracy bureau should note that you're backing the industry. the big mistake of the prosecutors: they don't see that mp3-blogs have the credibility to trigger interest and boost sales, and will eventually substitute music magazines. should they try to sue you, magazines and newspapers (think of Les Inrockuptibles, or the progressive German magazines) will start a campaign for the freedom of music, and the freedom of the consumer. As soon as they sue you or any other serious blogger, the industry's reputation will be on the line. Best wishes, LeDude
BeantwoordenVerwijderenHello
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI find it disgusting to attack blogs like yours, while in the meantime, anonymous blogs that offer FULL NEW albums can go unaffected. Suffice to read a few lines of your presentations to understand you're a real lover of music. So, posting two or three tracks of an album you like is endangering the French musical industry??? Pure nonsense. Those bastards are digging their own graves by selling their middle-of-the-road shit at extortionate prices, and placing interesting, creative stuff at the same level as utter sheet. Hold on, and if you petition for help or something, I'll be one of the first to support you. FILLES SOURIRES WILL NEVER DIE!!!
I don't know enough about the copyright issues involved here but you should also point out in your correspondance with these anti-piracy folks that your files are only online temporarily. They may be objecting to the fact that these are downloadable so you may consider streaming these files. Pitchfork, for instance, offers streamable and downloadable files and I'm assuming that they have some arrangement with music labels. Could you get in touch with the labels and get permission to post these audio files? I can attest that your blog has increased my spending of French pop music by hundreds of dollars. :)
BeantwoordenVerwijderenhey, i'm french, i'll write that stephane sccp guy... coming to think of it, there was a mention of your site in Les Inrocks, that influential music/mode weekly mag. might be worth shooting the writer of that review a word about your troubles. would make such a fine article... filles in trouble!
BeantwoordenVerwijderenThey won't get anything out of a lawsuit. Your site is too small, and 'MP3 blogs generally have a negligible, if any, effect on the profits of music companies, so there is little point in engaging in a costly lawsuit.'
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI simply don't understand musicians that dosn't make it possible to download their music. What are they afraid of? That their music will be played for more people? great! That someone who has the music on their Ipod will play it to a friend? more great! Come on, it's only an issue in conditions to sale, when you start living of it. However, Artic Monkeys gave their music away. They still do. And they are huge now!
Argh im pissed - don't close the site! It made me discover Vanessa & The O's, buy their album, and meet Van in person in London! People who come to mp3 blogs are REAL music-lovers, and searches for great music, not just downloading it from file sharing programs.
thanks for all the support folks. Filles Sourires will never die!
BeantwoordenVerwijderenCher Stéphane,
BeantwoordenVerwijderenJe me permets de vous écrire pour vous dire toute ma surprise à l'annonce de vos actions envers l'auteur du blog "Filles Sourires".
En tant qu'artiste, indépendante, pour le moment, de toute maison de disques, je me permets de vous dire à quel point un tel blog est immensément utile à la promotion de la musique, et, dans ce cas particulier, de la musique en français.
Je serais très triste qu'il arrive quoi que ce soit à l'auteur du blog, ou à son blog par ailleurs.
Je suis sûre que vous n'avez pas besoin qu'on vous explique la manière dont ce type de blog fournit une publicité gratuite, même si peu chaotique, aux artistes concernés. Ceux qui protégent leurs droits et leurs revenus ne devraient que s'en réjouir et appuyer, si besoin est, le travail de ces bloggeurs, si essentiel à une revitalisation de l'industrie du disque.
Ils sont à l'avant-garde de modes de diffusion et de promotion nouveaux. Laissons-les faire leur travail et vivre leurs amours en paix.
J'ai cru comprendre que Filles Sourires auraient mis en ligne des titres non encore disponibles à la vente. C'est sûrement la ligne qu'il se pourrait de tirer. Vous savez que ces bloggeurs "musique", bloggeurs du monde entier, se font fierté d'agréer à une charte qui les contraint à retirer de leur site tout mp3 que leurs ayant-droits n'y souhaitent pas figurer. Je suis sûre que la voie de la diplomatie, et la balance qu'elle implique entre les satisfactions de chaque parties, sera celle que la SCPP empruntera dans cette histoire. Après tout, nous regardons tous, depuis le monde entier, vers la France pour une vision du monde humaine et sensée. Je vous écris depuis les Etats-Unis. Je vous prie de croire qu'il est bon de d'espèrer et de croire qu'on peut encore être raisonnable quelque part dans le monde... tout en restant économiquement viable sous de nouveaux modèles. Excusez mon cynisme mais, vous, depuis votre poste, vous ne sentez pas le monde changer? Vous ne voulez pas faire en sorte qu'il change? Pourquoi ne portez-vous pas la question au coeur même de votre activité? Chacun, nous nous devons de réfléchir ainsi. Sans exception... culturelle.
Je suis de plein coeur pour l'existence, la foisonnance de ce type d'initiatives privées et spontanées. La musique ne pourra continuer de vivre que grâce à elles. Les temps ont changés. Faisons en sorte qu'ils aient changé pour le mieux.
Merci.
marianne
http://www.myspace.com/mariannedissard
Let's sing some Brel for the French recoding industry:
BeantwoordenVerwijderen"Les bourgeois c'est comme les cochons
Plus ça devient vieux plus ça devient bête
Les bourgeois c'est comme les cochons
Plus ça devient vieux plus ça devient c..."
I think the promotional value in mp3 blogging as opposed to sharing full albums still commerciably available is obvious. On the other hand, that as a perspective might not be the issue here. Anybody buying new music from France will have noticed the industry there's gone quite balmy on copyright issues. Most French cds come with copy protection in fact. So provided this "agency" in fact exists, I would for my own part take it seriously. It could be they're looking to set an example - we know similar cases from the US.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenOn the other hand I don't know which artists the said agency "represents." And I expect their threats would in any way contain lots of bogus. But I don't know how that can be revealed. But one thing's for sure, any communication before a potential formal charge that constitutes a warning and ultimatum concerning artists for whom this "agency" doesn't hold any legal rights/responsibilities will in fact come down themselves (because assuming legal responsibility where you hold none is illegal).
For what it's worth, in that perspective the demand from this "agency" suggests a lack of serious intentions.
I don't know whether this helps you much though. But the best of luck!!
Funny that Arno, David Bowie, Sharon Stone and Axelle became "Chevalier des Arts et Lettres" for "significantly contribuing to the enrichment of the French cultural inheritance", while you who does the same (and at least more than Bowie and Stone), get a lawsuit :-)
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI hope this trouble and nonsense turns into good, your blog deserves it.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenSaludos!
You're not technically doing anything wrong, since the Mp3s are only on the site temporarily. There are so many music blog owners doing the same thing. They're just trying to scare you. I hate all these politically correct people
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI have a nice collection of songs from your site and i appreciate all that you do. I have purchased a few albums because of your knowledge.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI also think Elodie is one of the lamest artists compared to Ms. Bardo and April March - no complaint from her record company i bet. Your's and your readers love of music is refreshing and has educated me since before i found this blog only knew of Plastic Bertrand and didnt think there were any listenable french artists...how wrong i was. Keep up the great deeds.
If you need backup i have a pirate gun that should be sufficient for any frogcop :)
I only recently discovered this blog and am scrolling through your archives to expand my knowledge of all things French (in the meantime kicking myself for not discovering this site earlier). Yours is absolutely a work of love and should be treated as such by all!
BeantwoordenVerwijderenGreetz and don't let your head hang down!
PS: if all else fails: 'Aux armes et caetera!'
oh for goodness sake; if it weren't for this blog lots of French stuff would be completely by passing me - and I'm French! They're just being stupid. Unfortunately I have no advice to offer, just a little tantrum.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenYou can get some advice from moistworks too, they were in trouble a few months ago.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenKeep on fighting for good music, they're only fighting for money.
Hi,
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI'm not aware of all the legal implications on this matter, but there's a perspective that may be useful: the fact that you put mp3 files on your blog, doesn't make you that different from a radio station. THE difference is, probably they pay royalties, and probably you don't. But given the fact that we're talking about cents, I'm sure you can manage to pay them, and get rid of those guys.
As for the fact that people can copy the files, well, on the radio anyone can record any music too. Maybe the ones who do it can be called pirates. But NOT the radio station. So why would you be?
All the best and keep your nice work in promoting lots of musicians and their music… for free!
V
That's only ever happened to me once in over two years of blogging. The wankers at Numero Group asked me to take down a couple of tracks I posted from one of their compilations. They said that I was taking money from the artists and I argued I was doing the exact opposite but it did no good so I took them down and vowed never to buy or plug another record they put out. Which is a drag as they put ut some very tasty compilations.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenIk zou het heel erg vinden als je zou stoppen. Niets aantrekken en doorgaan!
BeantwoordenVerwijderenHi Guuzbourg
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI have just discovered you are a real danger for girls singing in French. I though you were rather a chance for them, the chance to make them discovered all over the world, to promote their records and also the French language. Thanks to your site, Coralie Clément has probably sold records in Brazil and Honduras, and Elisa Point, is about to be cult in Romania.
Please take the time to translate Marie Dissard post, it's full of good ideas. Try maybe to discuss with SCPP if it is possible to. May be find an alternative way: no more than one MP3 per record promoted, or no post with mp3 before it's been published.
I am not a legal specialist but the nice Christophe in his e-mail refer to French rules, as you are a citizen from Netherlands doing your blog from Netherlands (what says the law in your country about that?), try to know if they can really do something against you.
You also should know that there were a debate in France through the French parliament last winter and springtime and Blogs were about to become legal, and in the last the music industry lobbying succeed trough the "Conseil constitutionnel" to make MP3 blogs illegal (in the same way than pear to pear). I tell you that because it's about to be election in France in 2007, and left and right are very concerned with the P2P,Blogs regulation and take their distance with SCPP philosophy. They know the youth is very sensitive on their vote with those questions. I suppose SCPP at this moment, don’t need to make people speak to them, to be in the political debate. I think it's a good time to contact French magazines and newspapers. Try to. I know you were ranked in the best blogs by les inrockuptibles, propose them an ITW (you are a star on the web no?). Contact Liberation, they have an online newsletter called Ecran, if they don't know you, tell them about the story of your blog, what you do to promote French artists all over the world (ranked among best blogs in several countries), and what SCPP promise you to reward for this job.
Take care.
Sébastien.
you're too kind, Sebastien. Let's just see what happens for the moment.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenWow. I've only recently discovered good mp3 blogs like yours and yours would be so missed.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenYes I am downloading songs and making enjoyable mix CDs of french music for free. AND I AM BUYING FRENCH CDS I ABSOLUTELY NEVER WOULD HAVE BOUGHT WITH YOUR BLOGS INTRODUCTION. And paying insane import prices for some. You are clearly creating demand.
Good luck mon ami!
This is a great blog and you're a hero for not surrendering immediately at the first whiff of danger - are you sure you're really french?
BeantwoordenVerwijderenDon't put up anything by that record company again, and I'd put a little note on your posts for readers of this blog to boycott music by that record company.
Get everyone who uses this site to write to the company in question protesting against their bullying tactics, pointing out that your site increases the amount of music sold and telling them that they'll also boycott that company's product. Put an easy link up to the company's page.
Make it clear on every post that you'll take down the music if the company selling it objects.
Make sure this story gets out to like minded french and music bloggers. Stories like this can go round the internet like wild fire and quickly make the company look petty and stupid. Point out the disparity in a three year jail sentence and the 'punishment' the rioters in the french suburbs get for torching cars, attacking policemen and burning down community centres.
Support can be mobilised very quickly when you remember that you're not alone in facing these issues. Get the blog swarm working for you. The company relies on intimidation.
Can you host your blog overseas or in some way escape french law on this point, if it is against you?
Fight back, remember, if these guys are French, they'll surrender.
Despite all the excellent advice here, which you should take, wait and see is really the best option for now. Let the pissed off Frenchmen make the first real move - words are cheap. The chances that he really wants to spend his waking hours defending some 'lousy' artist are slim.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenPhilosophically, since this blog is so popular because it's good, trying to shut you down proves the complete lack of understanding from copyright owners.
Your a pioneer and your inspired iniative could help change the rules. Stick it out. Let him try to close blogspot down...(pffff)
We can always go down to Paris and beat the bloody crap out of him :)
Monsieur Guuzbourg,
BeantwoordenVerwijderenThis is ridiculous. I think it's downright presumptuous for them to make that sort of request. It's one thing for them to ask you to take down the Elodie tracks, but the whole site? Preposterous. Considering all MP3s are only posted for a limited time, I'd say you're being more than reasonable and respectful of the singers and copyright laws concerned.
Anyway I've been lurking like mad, but would just like to say thanks for this excellent site...where else would I have found such an assortment of Banana Splits and the muted elegance of Marianne Dissard in one place?
Greetings from Singapore,
Enid Coleslaw
muted elegance - what a wonderful expression. you reading this, marianne?
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI'm french, living in the US, and thanks to you I discovered some quality music from my own country, some of which I later bought. Curiously, I am also one of the few french people condamned for copyright infringement over the internet :) Legally, you should not have to worry very much, as you are not a french citizen and do not live there, as I understand. So, fuck them, and keep up with your outstanding work here. I especially love your introductions for every artist you present, it's not just "Listen to that, it's good". Your knowledge of french culture should be lauded. I will propose your name for the Legion d'Honneur :)
BeantwoordenVerwijderenLike most blokes, i like a teaze....but if the teazer is in close proximity eventualy the teazee's like to get what we are being teazed (unless its a payforviewonly gentlemens? club)
BeantwoordenVerwijderenLet me try to explain from personal experience.
I can watch Kylie(first name basis but we have and never will meet) and accept her brilliant tease with wishfull sit on my lap imagine/admiration.
But if the girl i work with/next to wants to shake her peach in front of me and not expect me to want to chase and hopefully have a taste....that girl has another thing coming. And if her boyfriend enticers her to do so just to make me jealous so they can get their kicks, then fire on both of em.
The beautiful french ladies & dogs(men) you have on this blog bring them closer to the audience FS has accumulated through the greatest medium....music.
This is only going to increase as the site gets better and better. Just keep the frogestapo at a safe distance and everythings sweet.
Filles Sourires! ( i have read somewhere what it actually says in english but to me it reads - young female gone sour? - surely not! ) the music here is exceptional and i again with a pseudonym commend the runner(s) of this blog's musical taste/ knowledge as i search out more songs by Austine to keep her on first name basis.
I deeply support you.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenkeep us updated.
Hi Mr Guuzbourg,
BeantwoordenVerwijderenYou are doing great things, introducing people to new (and old) french music, I love the site and recommend it to anyone I know who loves music.
Maybe if you just supply links to the sites that (officially) carry the mp3s or their myspace pages.
Keep up the good work, I've bought loads of stuff on your recommendations, and look forward to buying more.
+A+
It was depressing to pop onto your blog (which I link to from my blog, I like it so) and see all your mp3 links struck through, and then to read the humourless warning you received from a bureaucrat who is protecting us from nothing. It brings to mind the old saying: no good deed goes unpunished.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenHow can anyone regulate word of mouth? How can anyone quantify what your promotional efforts do to damage sales? I would say your efforts do exactly the opposite. I support what you are doing here.
I sure hope you get things worked out. Filles Souries are my passion as well, and I've bought 8 cds becasue of your site.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI have the feeling as soon as organizations like SCCP prosecute sites like this one, they no longer aim at the artists' good but only their own monthly figures.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenIn short, they look at their grid of figures based on certain criterias, not at what it means in reality.
Too bad.
That's why I decided not to buy any cds anymore from non artists who are not independant or artists not putting their music under free distribution licence (like creative common).
It's not against the artists, it's again a system, according to me, fooling the artists.
I didn't know this website before today and will maybe never come back (I don't want to cause harm by coming here and give SCCP a reason for blaming this kind of websites).
I wish a long life to this website.
Bye bye.
/glattering
I worry about this issue a lot. Luckily, I haven't been contacted yet, but when I do, I don't think I will have much of a leg to stand on.
BeantwoordenVerwijderenI actually tried to sign up with the royalties collection agencies in the UK. The problem is, while the agency dealing with publishers of songs (MCPS/PRS) is organised for mp3 bloggers, and happy to give a licence for approx 4000 downloads at a fee of £200, as long as you are running it as a hobby the other agency (PPL) dealing with record companies and artists is powerless to do the same (in fact, to their distaste) - they say the record labels insist on your contacting them one by one, and making some kind of deal. It could prove mightily expensive, unless they go for the 'I am promoting your stuff' argument.
As for 'we'll all write angry letters to the press' approach to litigation, I fear that once lawyers are involved, this would avail us naught. I advise take down any track by that record company, and steer clear. And always make a clear link to where you can buy the CD with every post that you can.
"muted elegance"! that'd apply to you too, guuuzzzz, if you were to be scpped by the scppers. guuzz on mute!
BeantwoordenVerwijderen